Talk:Slaughterhouse

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There have been numerous slaughterhouse investigations over the past several years. I think these are highly relevant and should be re-included.

This needs to be split out into modern slaughterhouses, and historical info. Mark Richards 18:43, 20 Oct 2004 (UTC)

I removed the phrase Most horse slaughter is done in Europe until it can be supported by a citation. Una Smith 02:32, 16 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Moved link added by an anon to here

To read more on work being done on the slaughterhouse in Delhi, India:

Visit http://blog.sarai.net/users/ritika

Initially it doesn't look promising, but about a page down there is a significant amount of information relating to Delhi's main slaughterhouse. Its a bit POV, but also has an international perspective, so somebody could probably extract some useful details for the article. -- Solipsist 09:13, 25 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Hi

Sorry, I made a cut instead of a copy. Glad you noticed it and fixed it. Reply to David Latapie 17:18, 25 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

shouldn't there be a warning disclaimer before the process section if it so disturbing to know how animals are slaughtered, like for example:warning:the following may include disturbing unpleasant details on the slaughter of an animal.

That might make a little sense, but why would anyone look at the slaughterhouse page if they didn't want to know about slaughterhouses? Tekana (O.o) Talk 09:09, 25 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Exactly. The title of the section is "Slaughterhouse", not "pink bunny petting zoo". Jake b 05:41, 26 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Indeed, it is offical policy that Wp:not#Wikipedia_is_not_censored. I think the article requires more pictures of abattoirs, pictures that show what they are like inside and how the animals are processed. If someone comes the the "Slaughterhouse" article and is easily offended, they can 'turn off images' in their webbrowser. Ashmoo 04:46, 30 May 2006 (UTC)+[reply]

Is there a page about and linking to those slaughterhouse videos where the cows were left to die in a pool of their own and other cows blood with their trachea hanging out while an employee kicked blood on its face? Ok, maybe that's too specific but I think it is common knowledge that slaughterhouse conditions are disgusting and inhumane. I would like to know more about it and see if anyone else has been able to sneak in and get real footage? 19:12, 18 February 2008 (UTC) The big Cowhuna

I noticed one particular phrase and a friend of mine pointed it out.

"In their turn, most slaughterhouses are secretive to avoid controversy."

they follow strict USDA regulation by the federal government and are not "secrective" at all. Its just that the general public isn't allowed access just like any other corporate enterprise would deny you access into their establishment because you have no business there.

KerryJones 22:34, 1 November 2005 (UTC)[reply]

You are probably right. I thought that might have been my wording following a big POV cleanup last Novemeber. There had been some stronger statements in there before, and it looks like the phrase has been subsequently strengthened again to 'secretive' by someone else.

Ideally you want a phrasing that suggests that abatoirs are happy to be ignored. Its not really true that all corporate enterprises are equally secretive. There's a spectrum. If you were a journalist and said you wanted to do a piece about them, most companies would be happy to show you around. Some might have industrial secrets or health and safety concerns and not want to show you sensitive parts of the factory, but they would still welcome the free publicity.

I suspect the opposite is the case with most abatoirs — they are not customer facing businesses and would have little to gain from the publicity. It is certainly possible to visit them, but my guess would be you would have to work harder to pursuade them that you weren't a threat. -- Solipsist 12:39, 2 November 2005 (UTC)[reply]

well there are many places in which the public is never to view for an example a gas company wouldn't allow you to go around their factility or nuclear power plant. I know quite a few companies who don't allow public access to their factility. I'm pretty sure if I wanted to do a documentary on a Slaughterhouse there are companies out there who would gladly show me around.

I've seen a dairy farm where they showed the device that attaches to the utters and milk the cow.

Hmmm, well actually, until recently my local nuclear power plant, Sizewell B in Suffolk, had a visitors centre. They were really quite keen to get people to come and have a look at the plant and try and counter the general public's negative perception of nuclear power — they even advertised on TV for a while. Unfortunately the visitors centre was closed down a couple of years ago due to increasing fears over the possibility of a terrorist bombing (see BBC news story). Now you can't get withing ten miles of the place. -- Solipsist 18:29, 2 November 2005 (UTC)[reply]

the point being that not all of them don't want to avoid conversty, its just a place that really isn't suitable for people visiting. I doubt a slaughterhouse would setup a visitor centre. 172.139.245.160 22:41, 2 November 2005 (UTC)[reply]

When I was a fairly young kid (maybe twelve or so), I was taken to a sausage factory (which I believe killed pigs as well) on a school field trip. While we were shown around quite a bit of the plant, we did not see any animals or any meat or really anything to indicate what really happened there. Just pointing this out as a statement of fact. Draw your own conclusions. Or if you really want to know, call up your local kill place and ask if they do tours, and if so what they show. Epastore 02:18, 14 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I don't think this article is at all NPOV. We raise sheep, we live down the road from a former slaughterhouse, so I have some experience of them. Obviously the ethical concerns involved are important to the article, but I don't think they should appear in the introduction. (Ethan Mitchell, Feb 25, 2006)

The article is about Slaughterhouses, not the ethics of meat eating. That discussion has no place here. Jake b 05:48, 26 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Ethical concerns are of great importance to this article. Although Ethics of Eating Meat is the main place for the discussion, slaughterhouses are pretty central to the issue, and this article should include some discussion of ethics and the treatment of animals in slaughterhouses. Saluton 02:39, 23 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

1st let me chime in on the secretive stuff. The slaughter plants are pretty nasty. There is no way you would want to visit them. When I drove a truck I had the unfortunate experience of having to spend the night parked at one in Dodge City KS. It's about 1 mile from the other (there are 2 there). The smell is so bad that just being outside can make you nauseous. Inside, God help you. I have also slaughtered more than my fair share of cattle, pigs and sheep. I was an ag major and we had a class that we simply called "Slaughter class". Guess what we did. I hated that class and thus didn;t go much. Bad plan. I took it 3 times. Anyway, these places are nasty not to mention too dangerous to have visitors shuttle through. Besides, if a visitor were to accindentally loose something like a pen, that would shut down the plant for hours while they looked for it. Forein matter in the food is a big deal.

Anyway, some comments on the article.

• It would be good to note that live inspection is always done by a veterinarian. Also, the USDA has decided not to allow the slaughter of downer cattle. I'm not so sure about pigs and sheep but I assume this also applies to them.
• The inspection and grading of the carcas are two separate issues. Every carcas must be inspected. It need not be done by Federal inspectors. If the meat is not to be offered for sale outside of the state in which it is slaughtered, it can be inspected by a state dept of ag inspector. Many states simply choose not to offer this service in which case it would be done by a federal inspector.
• The grading of a beef or sheep is voluntary. As the slaughter house pays for each carcass graded, they only send those that are sure to be graded select or better to be graded. Who cares if that old cow graded "Cutter".

In the history section, it might be nice to mention the move to boxed beef, and the laws that were enacted as a result of The Jungle. Also, how refirgeration led to the move to large packing plants.

Just my 2 cents worth. matt

To answer a previous question, the USDA does allow downer pigs to be slaughtered.

Also, regarding design considerations... There have been some recent changes in design concepts for the movement of pigs into stunning systems. New designs have eliminated single-file corrals and have instead implemented a type of 'batch processing' method which moves small groups (about 8 for CO2 stunning--depends on machine design) of pig into the stunning area. This greatly reduces the stress level of the animal before stunning. We also eliminated prods and now use an automated herding system. I have seen the new Butina dual backloaders in action (CO2 stunning system) and it is much better than the old single-file system we replaced. In fact, to effectively pass an animal stress audit, you about have to eliminate single-file herding and prodding.

AC

The OD of Etymology doesn't corroborate the etymology offered for "Shambles," and the point of the passage seems to be to editorialize about slaughter, not to provide useful information. I cut it. (Ethan Mitchell, Feb 25, 2006)

I didn't see anything on Kosher slaughtering, and I think there are some similar Islamic procedures about such things. Should there be any mention or linkage to relevant articles? Jake b 05:45, 26 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

There are links to Kosher and Halal under the "Slaughterhouse process" section. I have edited the links to point them to the section discussing slaughering method. Under "International variation", there is also mention of halal and kashrut laws requiring animals to be slaughtered when conscious, hence no stunning before killing. --Dodo bird 08:37, 27 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Hey If anybody lives in or near Smithfield, Virgina then can that person tell me If the largest slaughterhouse in the world is open to the public, I would love to visit it.

Why not make a list of the major slaughterhouses of the world —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 141.153.204.25 (talk • contribs) 17:09, 25 August 2006.

In the United States, there is the Humane Slaughter Act of 1958, an unenforceable declaration of policy requiring that animals be stunned before killing.

"unenforceable" doesn't seem like the right word here. It suggests that the law cannot be enforced. Humane Slaughter Act doesn't seem to support that assertion. Perhaps "poorly enforced" or "unenforced" would be more appropriate. (Note: I have no opinion and no information on the enforcement status of this law; my interest here is in consistently reporting that status, whatever it might be construed to be.)

Jordan Brown 05:45, 20 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I moved all the discussion of big slautherhouses into a new section to keep it all together. I don't know how it ought to be structured, but what's there now isn't very good.

It might be interesting to expand it by listing the types of animals handled at each facility.

Jordan Brown 23:02, 6 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I am an animal lover and strongly believe that your web site is stupid any one whoever thinks about hurting an animal should suffer the painful death but someone who dose should die in the most painful way possible like the animals do anyone who works at a slaguhterhouse and perticipates in the senseless murder of animals should die and go to hell suffering the way animals do!I am a vegetairian meat is stupid let the animals be free and happy and die the way God wants them to.and for cows that have to be milked let kind farmers have them to be cared for properly

I removed the word "mortifying" from the description of the slaughter prcedure and I am also doubting the use of an iron rod in the description of iserting a rod into the anus of the animal. Wouldnt any iron tool of this job begin to rust? I am unsure though as to the fact of this procedure...--69.151.38.40 02:29, 2 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

"Animals are usually made unconscious by stunning or "knocking" using various methods including the use of a captive bolt pistol or applying an electric shock to the animal's head."

The problem is that this method (as well as the others listed) do not render the animal "unconscious," they actually kill the animal. For some reason, this wording seems like a subtle way to push a POV, or give the article a less controversial tone. That aside, we need to be down-right technical -- "unconscious" and "death" cannot be used interchangably.

This can be somewhat debated, because death is not gauranteed. While captive bolts were designed with the intention of simply stunning the animal and destroying central nerves, it often results in death. 74.242.99.231 22:29, 30 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]